Wonder why guns are the most logical option? . IOWs, pathetic sheeple. You know, due to the stress of OH MY GOD SOMEONES BREAKING INTO THE HOUSE AND HES GOT A GUN! It has a safety, but I dont really care about that. Glock is a brand of polymer-framed, short recoil-operated, locked-breech semi-automatic pistols designed and produced by Austrian manufacturer Glock Ges.m.b.H.. Mr Hoober, If you werent too busy arrogantly doubling down, you might consider trying it some time instead of pretending you know everything but I suppose you are probably more interested in getting audience engagement than giving good advice. Do you supposes THIS guy knows the six letter word for a firearms dangerous end? All I get is replies that they are working on it. Capacity: 15 rounds. In that book, they suggest that the proper way to carry a semi . My opinion. I dont know how high Id have to go to get it to ignite, but I figure Im never going to carry my piece 8+ off the floor, (seeing as how thats the height of most ceilings). Dry fire and have a friend rush you with a fake knife. While millions of Americans keep and/or bear GLOCKs and GLOCK-like striker-fired pistols without mishap, mishaps do sometimes occur.Let's face it: the average gun owner has lousy trigger discipline. If a person was going to leave a gun in Condition 3, they had better practice loading and firing the pistol, because not doing so just might get them killed. Do u carry an AR all day too? Situational risk assessment. The Glock if it came under the Governments Consumer Safety Council would never have been allowed on the market. Does the gun have a external safety, or is it internal. Now, what about those darn useless novelty CCH badges? From someone that ignorant, nothing he says or does would surprise me. Dave: And the 1911 series 80 fits into that category. If you have a modern weapon in a holster that covers the trigger, you are in pretty good shape. It appears to me that Darwin and his theory of evolution is again being ignored, if you are dumb enough to carry without forethought, please ace yourself before you breed. Folks, a GLOCK (or any other striker-fired pistol) is perfectly safe with a little intelligence combined with a bit of assiduity. Five years ago I reviewed the Glock 43, the second pistol in Glock's "Slimline" series of thin grip pistols. So old single actions have to be handled and loaded in a certain way to be carried safely. Amen brother. Colt change the SAA!? Ok revolvers. If you were to compile a list of incidents of the GLOCK ND and start reading through them, youll find that in virtually every single instance, human error was the culprit. It has good stopping power and it only slightly has more recoil . I got to 8 feet off the floor and a Series-70-style 1911 clone would not ignite the primer. Nor with his next, more significant error, suggesting that floating or inertial firing pin guns (like a 1911) ARE drop safe with a round in the chamber, even though all such firearms with a round in the chamber WILL fire if dropped on their muzzle? Still disagree? . However, that may be the reason I carry a revolver, but the reason I carry a gun (as I said) is because ITS MY GODDAMN RIGHT. Stop buying Glocks. 1 you many not have time to chamber. The list of pistols that have a drop safety to prevent the gun from going off unintentionally when impacted is quite long you need to look no further than any of the handguns allowed in the . An old retired civil servant who used to clean toilets in a federal building living off a small pension and social security. Go peddle your homosexual fantasies elsewhere. The driving analogy is a good one, because we drive so much (most of us, anyway). But that would mean giving up my beloved 1911! More solid irrefutable proof that the Glock is an accident waiting to happen. I got two strikers, finally, couple years ago, a 9mm and a 40. The practice of empty chamber carry continued with the introduction of magazine-fed, semi-automatic pistols. (AgCatJHS at English Wikipedia [Public domain], via Wikimedia Commons)Here we have a conundrum. For those of you that don't know, "Israeli Carry" is the practice carrying a pistol without a round in the chamber. Training happens every time we do something, no matter if its shooting, driving, or eating. Will again once they are old enough to figure out crapping ones pants is a bad idea. In the absence of further information, which is never forthcoming, the logical conclusion is: They dont want to fix it. I use either a DiSantis OWB when its jacket/coat weather or an Alien Gear 3.5 IWB when it Polo or T shirt weather. Glock 22 Gen 3 (Photo: Gunprime) The full-size Glock 22 was made to fill the gap between .45 and 9mm. If the slide goes back far enough to be out of battery, then the gun will just fire out of battery. See the old Remingtons. Thats intentional. ended up in the guys nostril, and he still didnt get quiet, until he heard the cocking of the hammer. Never happened yet I would rather shoot myself in the leg but still be in fight than have bad guy shoot me because I didnt have a chambered round. I lost a whitetail in heavy cover to the click when the safety is released. Dani: Many competition shooters boast about having it done to their race gun. Then I chambered a round. as for being out in public goes if somebody gets the drop on me with a knife or firearm at super close range i figure that im only going to be 50/50 on that anyway When I was new to guns I bought a DA/SA pistol with safety/decocker because I lacked the confidence to go with a hot gun without the safety, never fell for the empty chamber myth as a safe way to carry, always thought it was a sure way to get killed.. Once I was confident enough, now I only carry a gun without a safety and it always has one in the pipe, always carried in a holster. Hell, try it with a taser. Point the holstered G19 downrange at a target and try to fire it without removing it from the holster. Between the trigger safety, the firing pin safety and the drop safety I feel very comfortable carrying it chambered. As long as you use some sort of holster that covers the trigger, and keep your finger out of the trigger area, leave the 19 in the holster, unless its needed, you wont have a problem. Glock 17. All terrific replies. If you are so scared of a striker fired trigger, then why not get a hammer fired gun? One of the first shoot houses ever built was built by Fairbairn and Sykes to train their officers. . But as Sam has pointed out, one needs to practice and I have. The first Glock safety that you will interact with is the trigger safety, which takes the form of a spring-loaded lever located in the center of the trigger. Let's talk about wh. In non service activities, all occurred either nearly cheek to cheek, face to face, or less than 3 ft. when chit went south, and it happens so fast, Id bet few if any pro operators could rack then stack em You learned something. uncommon_sense: I would hope that, by now, you know whether or not the handgun you actually OWN has a firing pin safety. Old school, extract, thumb, trigger finger, rinse n repeat often until autopilot takes over. That scenario is at least as plausible as a robbery. Especially in a stressful situation. Height: 5.4. 2. link to What is a Pistol Caliber Carbine. Even in that highly unlikely scenario, the gun would likely kill them anyway, even without going off, by blunt trauma alone. I actually think thats worth a healthy debate and article all on its own. In order to fire, the pin needs to be hit hard enough to continue forward, past the point of contact with the hammer, and then into the primer. A number of gun companies still produce single-action revolvers. Stop all AR-15 and AR-10 calibers with this RTS Tactical level 3+ Armor Kit. Long story short, I let it be known that I thought carrying with an empty chamber is a mistake. silly? More : Glocks are safe to carry with a loaded chamber as long as they are carried in a . When I was a lot younger, I was riding horses with some friends. And its nowhere near so light a trigger pull that you could just bump it and it fires. The most likely time a kid will get their hands on my gun is if it somehow gets knocked loose from my [high-quality, proper-retention] holster during movement in tight spaces while I am wearing it. Glockster20. The engineer who designed a take down system whereby the slide has to be forward and you have to pull the trigger must have on that day tripped out on LSD. Keep your chin up, youll get it eventually. So F_____g what? Glocks are designed with internal safety features to prevent accidental discharge. Even though everyone who has ever used and examined a SA revolver can easily see that the firing pin is ALWAYS in contact with the primer when the hammer is down, if the chamber under it has a round in it? @ mark s: +1 here. There was also some discussion of Fairbairn and Sykes experience in the Shanghai police with what is commonly referred to as Israeli carry. There are some inherent problems there. And in my opinion , and this would be scary, Id bet my draw and cock against the draw rack the slide anytime. Even some shotguns will do that. I am pretty tired of people telling me how to handle my weapons. Its just not for me, especially as I get into my golden years. A GLOCK does not have an external manual safety. In my 3-screw, yes. The odds are not in favor of the added time it takes to try and chamber a round, let alone the stress of a real situation. And, it actually impeded officers ability to hit a target. It was being carried in an improper holster or the operator got careless in putting the pistol back into the holster, by not making sure the path was clear. The Baltimore Police Department, Los Angeles Police Department, Miami Police Department, and Maryland State Police are all known to utilize the Glock handgun. Absolutely. Heres how all of this bogus started. You have entered an incorrect email address! I have trained chambering on the draw and while it is less effective I am still way ahead of the guy who doesnt carry. Back in the old days of guns, they didnt really have any safety at all. - I'm too old to still think I know everything. Holstered the Glock like that into kydex holster. Am I being silly? I felt a few of the points that were raised had enough merit to discuss further. Unlikely. The most common objection was something is better than nothing (or words to that effect). Its kind of unneeded though, because inertial firing pins can only build firing inertia on their own if the whole gun accelerates, and then stops suddenly. Apply the 21 foot rule. Carried chambered until the kids came. Some people were never meant to have a handgun I suppose. While carrying or holstering? I carry locked, loaded with a extra clip close by. Just the easier reloading of the old Ruger 3 screw models (or any other regular types like the Colt SAA) vs the new ones, makes up for that one extra round, at least IMO. A forum community dedicated to Glock firearm owners and enthusiasts. Kaboom he shot himself as he sat there at the dinner table. The stone cold killer blows a hole in the braggarts forehead and his buddies stand there with their jaws agape while he starts shooting them. Pray the opponent was just carrying a Taser and not a knife. An unchambered gun is a dangerous, useless-to-you half measure. 1 of 2 Go to page. Those stances, their great for cops and competition but IMO bot so great in a gunfight up close. Of course all of those Glock NDs were due to human error. But carry the way you feel comfortable. He thinks. Have you ever negligently turned down the wrong way of a one way street? As for the replicas, these are hit-and-miss when it comes to carrying on an empty chamber. But if the gun has to be pointing at the ground for the problem to occur, then how big a problem can it be? I like having a gun ready to shoot but I need a second chance when Im juggling. I didnt mention this stuff because in the original post because the number of people out there who keep a single-action revolver as a home defense or self-defense gun is likely negligible. But in any case, the inertia must lie directly in line with the round, and then the round must stop suddenly, like when the muzzle hits the ground. . But thats good. Am I being silly? Glocks have a feature that prevents the trigger from accidentally being pulled, blocks the firing pin until the trigger is fully pressed, and the pistol is not actually cocked until the trigger is puled. The internal Safe Action System will not allow the pistol to go off accidentally. Kathy Jackson suggests that doing this safely comes down to two things, equipment and habits. Fat troll. I can cycle the bolt almost as fast as I can take the safety off, even when I stepped on a black bear who was sleeping under a downed tree. carrying or keeping a gun with a round in the chamber, Standard Manufacturings New S333 Revolver Fires Two .22 WMR Rounds at a Time, District of Columbia AG Subpoenas NRA Foundation Financial Records, Gov. It would be as if a round was pushed into the ground, primer up, and then a firing pin dropped from a height, point down, directly into the primer. Or some jackass was pocket carrying his G43 without a holster and something snagged the trigger. Pray the gay away gov. . The graveyards are full of former motorcycle riders and Glock users. Like a handgun, the defensive long gun should be secured in a safe or one of the wall-mounted quick-access locks. The 43 chambered for the 9x19 cartridge, along with its immediate predecessor the .380 caliber Model 42, were not the . So lets just say its a personal choice and your way isnt better than mine, but I will never accidently shoot my leg or foot. The Glock 43 is VERY close in size to the Glock 42, but chambered for that 9mm cartridge some people demand - or at least don't frown on like they do the .380ACP. Length: 7.3. But my Glock has an empty chamber. The reason was that there wasnt anything between the hammer and either the nipple or the primer of the cartridge. There are lots of better choices out there than the glock. Notice if the trigger is ever depressed. I own several safes, and none of them fit in my holster. Firearm experts, including myself, consider the design completely safe and dependable. Like: condition 2 (good choice for a DA/SA autoloader), condition 1 (if your chosen piece has a manual safety), and etc. My point is that I see no benefit in limiting my defensive options. That makes a takeaway more likely to succeed if attempted. If the trigger safety is not depressed, the trigger will not move rearwards and allow the pistol to fire. I have for almost 40 years and have it properly holstered. At Incognito Concealment, we're confident we have the right holster for you. The Glock handgun is the preferred handgun of police worldwide. These Glocks have been beat to death and not once has the gun " fired " without some sort of trigger manipulation. Agree with the author 100%. Call us at (586) 333-4240, and we'll guide you through the process of choosing a holster to suit your needs. OMG I love those old Fractured Fairy Tales shows! Running this way I am even more vigilant about how I handle the gun. So in 2019, are you telling a revolver carrier to carry only 4 bullets instead of five?? So whats up? Note, the sentry safe does have a security vulerablity that can be mitigated by covering a hole with stainless steel tape. There are also the safety concerns . Repeatedly doing the same thing is training, because it becomes habit. However, that also creates issues. this aint Dodge city and you aint Bill Hickok Blam, Blam,Blam! The Springfield Armory XD-E is a new hammer-fired compact pistol. Two is one, one is none. You just have to scroll down to it. Widen your horizons. Sykes wrote their highly influential book, " Shooting To Live," based on their experiences with the Shanghai Police Department. Risk vs benefit should ALWAYS be a part of this decision. Practice holstering and unholstering without a round and see if the trigger is pulled. Do not ever suggest they change a true classic. So when do you get to be a klutz if youve taken the time to train those reactions until as the experts say you not only get it right, you cant get it wrong? So the trigger pull is utterly irrelevant *if* you are paying attention to your firearm which you should be doing, again, with *any* firearm. Want to vent about something? That is a good point that I have never heard before. Thats all Colt added to the series 80, the internal firing pin block. Recently retired the PPK in favor of a Sig P365. Being a klutz is one thing. So anybody can mess with anybody here at any time, by pretending to be somebody else. I've never been to the range with you and I know . Barnum should have said, There is a Moron born every minute so I guess I will have to say it for him. Despite its . Itll never come out to get cleaned, the retention will never fail, the gun will never fall out when you unbelt to take a crap in other words you dont make mistakes. I couldve even been Ken again, like I was here years ago. I cant believe this is even a subject for discussion. There we go. Do it right; prepare the firearm for immediate use and take the neccessary precautions given that state of readiness. Here's my situation: Carrying the pistol with a round in the chamber freaks me out. Does the gun have a firing block mechanism. I carry a single action 1911. Yes Sir I do and the ones scattered in the house also. My bedside gun is always a DA revolver. Cocked and locked . Ive done this quite a bit when rabbit hunting. Its funny how a pimp like VLAD TEPES is accepted and sometimes glorified for his rhetoric of cut and paste (fake news) values but a person who simply chooses a different way of carrying is villified and demonized by those who scream for personal freedom. No kids at home anymore so no worry there. On the other hand, most other striker-fired pistols count on the recoil spring to cock the striker. I think they heard how bad its getting over here and want to provide a better place to be, so that TTAG will be left with nothing but trolls and snowflakes. A little background: When Israel was founded, "drop safe" firearms were not as common as today and the fledgling state had a mixed bag . In a SA revolver, the next round is instantly available anyway, whether fully loaded or one short, quicker out of the leather for the first, second, and third shot than any other existing action type. Personally I dont just carry for my own personal defense, but also the defense of my country, my comrades and other citizens. Thought about getting the Sig with the external safety, but decided not too. Either you will practice with chambered, or chamber empty. Not exactly. That was a few years ago now. No thanks. Odds of the shooter getting 4 shots off would be pretty low. The Glock Gen 4 and Gen 5 models have actually become really popular with civilians and self-defense shooters alike. The guns must of been 1911s or Browning HPs or similar SA only. if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[250,250],'guntradition_com-leader-1','ezslot_8',113,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-guntradition_com-leader-1-0');I do know one engineer who figured out that if it was dropped from 221 feet and it lands on the right angle squarely on its barrel, it could possibly go off, but the bullet would immediately strike the ground and not do much after that. Passive safeties Are Not A Replacement for an active safety. The hammer connects with a firing pin thats integrated into the frame, which strikes the primer. if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[468,60],'guntradition_com-large-leaderboard-2','ezslot_2',112,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-guntradition_com-large-leaderboard-2-0');I, as well as others, have tested and tried to get the Safe Action System, to fail but without actually modifying parts, we havent been able to. All of that seemed a bit verbose for a blog comment, though. Ive been carrying mine daily for five years and will continue to carry it as long as I can. Ever. . It seems that as long as the trigger is not manipulated the pistol will not fire. MOLON LABE. this aint 1902 with a Colt .38 Long primitive revolver and you probably aint riding a horse in pursuit of cattle thieves. I would like to carry at the ready, but doing so really gives me the heebie-jeebies. Still chambered in 9mm, the G19 measures 7.28-inches in total length. Im a lefty and the controls on the P 89 are completely ambitious I love SA/DA hammer fired autos. Mar 8, 2017 (Edited by Moderator) The LCP II is just as safe to carry as any striker-fired gun on the market without a thumb safety, including every Glock and most M&P's etc. Its decocker is better than a thumb safety. I made a folder called TTAG comments, and put all pages Ive commented on in there. True dat. Glocks, Sig Sauer, Smith and Wesson, Barretta, and many other makes are safe to carry chambered, They have . I think I can answer that one. I would consider the weapon fully loaded at this point. An officer was chasing a man down a stairwell with his pistol drawn and the man was shot, but apparently, he was not actually a criminal. What is your birthday including time and birth location? Perfect analogy. Someone with little firearms experience who feels over confident in his/her carry technique is more likely to find him/herself in trouble. To fire the pistol, the trigger safety and the trigger itself must be deliberately depressed at the same time. More bad advice, did the author not learn from his first mistake? "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed." Carry without one in the pipe for a while to get used to it. But do suggest they make more of them and lower the price for us plebes. I only know my own lifes experiences, fwiw, too many LEOs cant hit chit no matter what the tool, and Im an honorary. So in 2019, are you telling a revolver carrier to carry only 4 bullets instead of five?? I am at a point in my life that I seem to lose a bit more of something every day and way I see it , I can actually admit to myself that I dont totally trust me without that little conscience click of the safety anymore . , I never said I dont make mistakes I just never have with a gun hurt your feelings knute man up and get over it, Look what I found: Sub-one second times, under stress are the norm when properly trained. Are Glocks Safe To Carry Chambered. Do u know what the 21 foot rule is? At least until the computer catches up and opens multiple copies. I find the whole thing absurd and literally every firearm expert agrees with me. There are advertisements for trigger jobs on striker fired guns to make them with an even less pull weight!! Congratulations. And unlike Mad, I DO make mistakes. If I feel the urge to admire, use and hold a finely engineered machine I might just as likely pull out and ogle any one of my watches, of my bicycles, of my cars, of my surgical instruments, of my fountain pens or of my firearms. Ive said it once, Ill say it again. In reality, the 1911 with only the grip safety would be as safe or safer than the Glock. But ready to goI still havent figured out a light for the AR(its EZ to hold small flashlight for a pistol). Agreed. sanctimonious what iffers You can also watch plenty of guys who have never once needed their guns in a confrontation, yet shot themselves because they kept one in the chamber. Wouldnt it be actually quicker to rack the slide than to retrieve your weapon from a locked box? Are Glocks Safe To Carry Chambered. It's offered in a wide range of cartridges, from .22LR to the .357 Magnum. I also felt the same way. Maybe you just fumble finger the Glock when its out of the holster being put in a lockbox or on the counter at the range. Quick easy to access and small enough for the P365, a spare magazine, and a small 300 Lumen Tac Light. Because if youre smart enough to be worried about a Glock short trigger and trigger safety, youre probably smart enough to know you need to train so that your trigger finger is never in the trigger until the sights are on target, and you take the time to inspect your holster for obstructions before holstering or unholstering. I think the controversy is whether or not a loaded magazine with an empty chamber constitutes an unloaded gun. Youll probably die trying to get your semi-auto back into battery after attempting a contact shot anyway. Its an unnatural, metallic noise that spooked him instantly, and I missed the snap shot at a running target, and he was gone. Please note, comments must be approved before they are published. When she holstered her Glock .40 it went off and the bullet went down her leg utterly destroying it. But how often are you a klutz when handling or holstering your firearm? I hope r.i.p is on your tombstone if you fail in a confrontation. If my gun lands at my childs feet, an empty chamber leaves plenty of time to prevent a tragedy, but a chambered striker-fired gun may not. Which gets me to this. Much longer than a Glock, twice as heavy as a Glock. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. A 16 year old In drivers ed may not be very experienced nor skilled, but at least in my day, was paying more attention than a driver more familiar with driving. It should stay the way it is. If you can have a momentary lapse of judgement handling a half million ft/lbs you could certainly have one while handling 350. Again, carrying with an empty chamber isnt wrong, but it just isnt quite right. The IDF has quit carrying with a round chambered. The are a couple videos out there showing issues with holsters (kydex included) where bending or twisting caused a discharge. Those who scream that everybody who doesnt think exactly like them, pick the same options as them, etc., are dumb for not recognizing that they are perfection itself, are just more of the loads of SJW types out for attention by putting everything and everybody down, to make themselves feel a bit better about not having a life. A lot of guns, particularly the early revolvers, were considered too dangerous to carry with a loaded chamber because a sharp bump or drop could cause it to fire. Does the Mossad or other Israeli special services Israeli carry? Apparently the last time it worked. With any decent holster you will be fine. To the point I know I can unholster, rack, and have my tritium dots centered on some perps forehead before they know whats coming. . Most 1911s come with a half cock safety, but again, you would have to ensure it was engaged properly and its prone to breakage. Second Media Corp., 111 Peter Street, Suite 600, Toronto, Ontario, M5V 2H1, Canada. The priming compound could care less WHAT hits it, so long as the blow has sufficient energy to activate the explosive charge in the primer, it will detonate. While numbers vary, reacting to something - anything - takes a .